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Bidding for air tickets on Priceline

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Old Jan 10, 11, 2:35 pm
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Lightbulb Bidding for air tickets on Priceline

For some time now, I have been intrigued that Priceline's air bidding product has really not received much attention. While based on the volume of bookings, the hotel product has been well promoted and there is an industry of websites that help bidders be more informed -- many websites that have an air bidding section do not have much activity. Moreover, I have not see the recent bonus dollars opportunity that are often created for the hotel and car rental products by Priceline themselves.

However, I believe the dollar savings of their opaque air product could be more substantial than the hotel offerings on a case by case basis. It could also be argued that the product is significantly more inconvenient versus the hotel or rental car bid options in terms of options, but for many situations, Priceline air bidding is a viable option.

I have also found a significant decrease in opaque air ticket opportunities on Hotwire (and its partner sites), but they appear to still exist from time to time. During a particular low fares period over the past years, the discount was not high enough versus the opportunity costs, but I believe that trend is changing again and price discrimination will be more relevant. This is assuming that capacity of available seats continues to exceed demand and that airfare comparison options remain easy to use so that consumers can determine the value of a round-trip ticket and their options before bidding.

For this post, I am focusing on the Priceline opaque air tickets product done via bidding. What is even more interesting is that recently, both American Airlines (http://aa.com/i18n/urls/ota.jsp) and Delta (http://upi.com/Business_News/201...5251293050612/) have reaffirmed the value of their Priceline partnership. Even if they were focusing on their retail ticket distribution, both airlines are known opaque air partners of Priceline. By referencing users to Priceline, clearly the opaque opportunities are not a threat or are very complementary to the overall sales strategy (segmentation).

Now, aside from the introduction, I have gathered some tips on opaque bidding. Many of from my own experience with this product in the recent year. I may be incorrect on the reasoning for some of what I observe, and I will correct and improve as needed for everyone's benefit.

When to Bid (Timing and Routes)
1) Determine what the lowest retail price for a particular route is regardless of season or how many days prior to travel (advance purchase) for the past year if possible. There are websites that have fare histories for this purpose. Let's say for a route that fare is $199 ($99 each way "on sale"). In general, if the best retail fare for your desired dates (not preferred times though) is close to that price, book retail. I have not seen Priceline go much below the lowest retail price offered on a particular route. When you consider the potential inconveniences and additional fees, saving $40 or less per ticket may not be enough to lose your opportunity to book a retail ticket.
2) Priceline states that they are great for last minute bids (within 2 weeks of travel). This is correct when the price for those routes is significant higher than the lowest known retail price for the route. Partner airlines may have given Priceline opaque inventory on the same route at their lowest retail price even when they are advertising a higher price in other retail channels. This gives you an opportunity to get that lower fare without the advanced purchase previously required.
3) There is no real preference of what routes are better for Priceline. I would consider any opportunity where the retail price is significantly higher than the lowest price for that route and where Priceline will actually consider your bid (they will tell you if a route is not available either with a message or a lack of bid options on their retail results display). Some feel that routes with lots of capacity (California to New York and vice-versa, Hawaii, Florida, Las Vegas, etc.) are better bidding routes, but in reality, I feel those routes are also more likely to have last-minute retail price drops due to excess capacity which can give you buyer's remorse.
4) If you bid in advance, you could find yourself overpaying just as you would in the hotel or rental car product. Knowing the lowest retail price for the route and staying close to that price especially when bidding far in advance will help you keep your bidding results better.
5) Major international routes are great opportunities, but I have not seen enough data to know the results of such bidding recently.
6) Make sure that the airline's own website is fully operational. You often cannot book fares if the own airline's website is down for maintenance (late night) as Priceline often cannot confirm the inventory/booking.

Websites that provide fare history indicators:
http://farecompare.com/fare-grap...GraphTabbed.do
http://bing.com/travel/ (Farecast)

Making the Bid
1) Priceline has successfully mixed their retail product and their opaque bid product where you will often be shown retail prices first. Again, if the retail price meets you needs, great. I suspect many well-meaning Priceline shoppers ended up buying retail tickets versus bidding because they did not realize that a fare in their budget/expected price was available. Great for Priceline, but not great for you if savings of $50 or more per ticket was potentially available. Again, this may be why airlines like Priceline because they are not just filling seats via opaque, but are selling a significant amount of retail fares. Also, Priceline likely has built direct links to many airline systems to support the opaque product which has been beneficial to the airlines in the GDS debate.
2) While I empasize the lowest retail price, it is obviously important to know the current price for your desired dates based on season/advanced purchase timing. Use the fare comparison site of your choice to seek out those prices. Note, just like the hotel and car products, you will not always get the airline that is advertising the cheapest ticket in retail. However, if there is limited inventory, that would affect availability on Priceline (no matter what you offer).
3) Know your regional airports. In most cities, Priceline will offer more than your preferred airport (like the hotel regions). This is usually great because some of the smaller airports could be 'free' rebids because they lack the major air service. However, be sure the smaller airport would be okay with you if they do have commercial service. Priceline could hide these airports from you, but it is to your benefit to have these rebid options.
4) Priceline likes you to overbid, but they do try to help you get a sense of what is possible. This is done a few ways. First, they do have a microsite for each city pair that shows both retail pricing and winning bid history (when they exist). Please note, it is unlikely they will show the lowest bids or best savings just like the hotel or car rental products. However, when you go to the first bidding screen, Priceline often shows you two highlighted city pairs for the best price opportunity. In general, I have seen these two city pairs have the lowest price available versus other options, but this could change if Priceline changes the site.
5) Priceline actually knows what inventory is available before you even confirm your bid. For example, if Starwood properties have inventory in your hotel region bid and you are bidding multiple rooms, the website will require you to use a different name for each room. If it was only Marriott, this would not be required. In the airline bid, there is a small box that estimates your total with taxes. If it pops with an estimate, it often indicates inventory is available. It may not be at that price point, but Priceline knows immediately what you will get (non-stop, combo one-stop plus nonstop, or one-stop both ways).
6) Pricing laws for airfare appear to favor you. For domestic itineraries, it appears currently about $7 to $8 is attributed to the fees of Priceline. Actually, you may find some counteroffers that indicate this exact amount. This also means, you can tell on an initial bid what type of flights you will get if your bid price is accepted. In some cases, you may get something better (such as a non-stop versus a bid that included taxes for a one-stop). Your taxes/fees will always be matched up to the number of segments on your awarded flight even if your committed to a higher total before you bid.
7) Sometimes I get the airline that had the lowest Kayak price (albeit at an even lower cost) and sometimes I get a bid accepted where the retail fare is much higher than many other available options. This is to remind people to not focus on current retail prices or options when bidding (as is true for the other bid prodjcts). You never know who has the inventory to sell nor which route you will get (aside from watching the non-stop/1-stop combination taxes).


Counter Offers and rebidding
1) Priceline has made some bad decisions to not allow you to choose off-peak and other options in your initial bid. For some routes, this is the only way to bid due to flight schedules. This means, you have to get a rebid opportunity to make this selection change. Also, if you are looking at a route that requires 2 stops, I would avoid using the bid system -- I have not see it price well in those situations.
2) Counteroffers can be undercut like you would do in the hotel product, but counteroffers are different in the air product because they often indicate some 'sacrifice' you need to make. This can include off-peak, date differences. and airport changes. You really have two choices. For airport changes or date differences you like, you can start a brand new bid and undercut the offer or you can do a rebid, but note that you need to make the appropriate changes for it to be successful.
3) Bidding on airfare is really time consuming because the number of entries with the new Secure Flight requirements are extensive. So, you need to be careful each time you do a new bid.
4) Priceline will again mix in its retail product in counteroffers. Watch the word carefully when it indicates as such. You can just start over to find such offers if you find them attractive.
5) Some people do a lowball initial bid to get an idea of the counteroffers. This does not always work, but you can try.
6) If you are aiming to undercut a particular retail price, make sure you know what airlines participate with the bidding product.
7) Often you have to counter-offer to get options such as non-jet or off-peak (if Priceline does not force you up front). This is important since small feeder planes labeled by major carriers are becoming the standard on many routes.

Participating airlines in bidding product (both domestic and international)
http://travelb.priceline.com/custome...E&question=558
(note: currently, there is no JetBlue, Alaska, or Southwest for domestic example)

Priceline site that lists option to bid when available and bidding histories if available (again, bidding histories are selective). To change your city pair, just change the URL and put in an appropriate city name and airport abbreviation. The airport abbreviation is the most important part and you have to keep the format consistent for this to work.

http://travelb.priceline.com/insideT..._City-NYC.html

Here I change it to Seattle to Dubai, just for fun:
http://travelb.priceline.com/insideT...Dubai-DXB.html
Or how about San Diego to London: (no bid history)
http://travelb.priceline.com/insideT...ondon-LON.html
Or Houston to Maui: (has bids)
http://travelb.priceline.com/insideT...adise-OGG.html
Or LA to London: (has bids)
http://travelb.priceline.com/insideT...loudy-lon.html

After booking (miles/benefits/changes/upgrades)
1) Frankly, since this is Flyertalk, the most important question is the miles and benefits. In general, you are supposed to get no miles or points. This is what you agree to when you bid. Sometimes, you may get miles or points if the airline is not very aggressive to lock it down. To be fair, like any great deal, try not to require the use of representatives or staff to make this happen. On some programs where I have received points (the kind based on the fare paid), it was based on what Priceline paid - not what I bid. There have been other threads on other forums that discuss options for getting miles that sometimes work. Sometimes, I get miles for one segment and not another based on system design. There is no point (pun intended) in complaining - you receive whatever benefit was awarded
2) Some airline policies are to allow you to use your status for preferred seating if you already have it. I have seen it in the UA policies listed on this forum. This can also be very important for free baggage if you have such status because those status are typically independent of whatever fare type you buy.
3) In terms of changes, again, not supposed to make any changes. Sometimes, you will get lucky to do so in the first 24 hours especially if a connection is bad or another flight the same day has space available in the same fare class. Also, if the schedule changes, usually, you can get a lot of leeway (just like any other non-refundable retail ticket you buy). Again, these are changes made directly with the airline and not Priceline. Most same-day standby are no longer free, but back in those days, that was also doable for most bid tickets purchased. Do not be surprised if you are allowed to buy or not allowed to buy a same-day standby option. Trust me, Priceline knows about these changes when they are made on your behalf by the airline.
4) In terms of status for VDB/IDB, you should be treated normally, but be sure you confirm your compensations before agreeing to such benefits. I would consider your tickets similar to free award tickets in this fashion.
5) In terms of purchased upgrades, sometimes you can buy them. As we have seen, almost everything is for sale these days with the airlines regardless of status or fare purchased.
6) There is a price guarantee where if you find the same exact flight pair cheaper anytime before the day before you leave, you can get the difference back plus a $25 bonus. This is actually a pretty nice benefit versus the airlines price guarantee (which is often only valid for first 24 hours). So, definitely use Yapta to track the price after you win.

Big Deal Guarantee
http://priceline.com/promo/big_d...ml?product=air

I hope this serves some usefulness for those who are looking for ways to try out the bid product for air tickets.

Thanks,
Rasheed
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Old Jan 10, 11, 8:25 pm
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There are obviously many, many good reasons a majority of people choose not use Priceline's NYOP method for airline tickets (no FF points, don't find out your itinerary until after purchase, inability to make changes, etc). However on a few occasions over the years I've used this product with 100% success and satisfaction.

First off, my travel is 95% leisure and I'm not tied (married!) to any specific airline FF program. Simply put, I'm not in it for the miles because I don't fly frequently enough to rack up enough miles to achieve worthwhile status. When I want to upgrade or fly on an award ticket, I transfer points from AMEX into an airline program and utilize FF perks that way.

Below are a few random experiences I've had with NYOP over the years.

1. SFO is my home airport. I'm a picky flier. If I can get to my domestic destination nonstop from SFO, then I'll do that any day over a connecting flight. My experience with NYOP has been that Priceline reveals the actual taxes/fees in their counteroffers. Having this information helps to determine if you're going to be assigned a nonstop or connecting flight. On the initial bid screen, Priceline calculates the maximum possible taxes/fees on top of your bid price. Again, it's the counteroffer that displays the actual taxes/fees you're going to be charged if you go through with the transaction.
On two occasions I've used NYOP from SFO to MCO because the taxes/fees in the counteroffer indicated a nonstop routing. And to sweeten the deal, at the time of these two trips, there was only one nonstop flight per day between the two airports (UAL), so not only did I know I'd be assigned a nonstop flight, but also the exact flight. If I were to do this again today, I wouldn't have the luxury of knowing which flight I'd be assigned because Virgin America now flies the route along with UAL. (I was pleased to see in the link that Virgin America is a partner with Priceline under NYOP).

2. Unlimited immediate rebid possibilities. Most people think they have only a few rebid possibilities (non-jet aircraft, selecting an alternative airport, red-eye, two connections, etc). This is not the case at all. Example: Rather than entering the airport city as your city of origin, instead enter a neighboring town, even if it doesn't have an airport.

Bid #1 - Enter Burlingame as your departure city, however on the next page select SFO as your choice of airport. If your bid is rejected....

Bid #2 - Enter San Mateo as your departure city, selecting SFO as your departure airport on the next page. If that bid is rejected.....

Bid #3 - Enter Berkeley as your departure city, selecting SFO as your departure airport.

So on and so forth.....

Priceline considers your enterting a different origin city/town with each bid as a change to a previously rejected bid. Priceline does not consider the airport you select to be your departure city for the sake of rebidding possibilities.

Using the above strategy in my previous bidding experiences has allowed me to increase my bid by $1 until finally reaching Priceline's target rate. For example, on one trip from SFO to MCO I began at $160. I made 11 different rebids, increasing by $1 each time before finally hitting the target rate of $171. With unlimited rebid possibilities, you can hit the target rate without overbidding by as much as $1.

3. On-line check-in. My last two NYOP flights, both times on UAL, I was offered the opportunity to pay to upgrade to Economy Plus and/or First Class during the on-line check-in process. So it would appear, with UAL, anyway, that they'll be happy to take additional $$$ on a NYOP ticket as they do from people traveling on any other "normal" fare.
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Old Jan 10, 11, 9:40 pm
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In many cases, airplanes are flying with very few empty seats. There is no need for the airlines to give away empty seats to priceline at bargain basement prices, they know they will probably be able to sell those seats themselves.

Until capacity increases quite a bit, the pool of seats priceline will have to draw from will remain pretty slim, certainly not like it use to be.

Last edited by cordelli; Jan 13, 11 at 1:13 pm
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Old Jan 11, 11, 11:31 am
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Originally Posted by cordelli View Post
In many cases, airplanes are flying with very few empty seats. There is no need for the airlines to give away empty seats to priceline at bargain basement prices, they know they will probably be able to sell those seats themselves.

Until capacity drops quite a bit, the pool of seats priceline will have to draw from will remain pretty slim, certainly not like it use to be.
I agree with you in theory for the reasons you state. In reality, I just made 4 NYOP test bids using lowball prices to ensure they wouldn't be accepted!

In each test bid I used outbound dates of tomorrow (Jan 12) with a return on Jan 19.

SFO-JFK. Bid $100. Received Counteroffer of $245.86. Best retail is $631 for nonstop or $465 for connecting flight.

SFO-IAD. Bid $100. Received Counteroffer of $297.00. Best retail is $1099 for nonstop or $571 connecting flight.

SFO-SEA. Bid $50. Received Counteroffer of $170.34. Best retail is $244 for nonstop.

SFO-ORD. Bid $100. Received counteroffer of $370.31. Best retail is $683 for nonstop or $500 connecting flight.

The taxes/fees on all counteroffers indicated a nonstop itinerary. The counteroffer rates posted above include all taxes/fees.

Airlines are giving Priceline inventory to sell under NYOP. At least on Wednesdays in January.

The savings for last minute travel NYOP vs. retail are fairly substantial IMO.
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Old Jan 11, 11, 11:54 am
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Yeah, that's exactly what I was referring to, next day tickets into an airport that will probably be closed because of blizzard like conditions.
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Old Jan 11, 11, 12:04 pm
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Originally Posted by cordelli View Post
Yeah, that's exactly what I was referring to, next day tickets into an airport that will probably be closed because of blizzard like conditions.
Any opinion on NYOP inventory being available on the return date of January 19?
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Old Jan 11, 11, 12:15 pm
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Not sure it would really matter as we apparently are not discussing the same thing.
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Old Jan 12, 11, 8:44 pm
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Originally Posted by cordelli View Post
In many cases, airplanes are flying with very few empty seats. There is no need for the airlines to give away empty seats to priceline at bargain basement prices, they know they will probably be able to sell those seats themselves.

Until capacity drops quite a bit, the pool of seats priceline will have to draw from will remain pretty slim, certainly not like it use to be.
I think you just have a miswording here. I believe you mean until capacity increases quite a bit...

I agree that airlines have dropped available seats as fast as possible to match demand, but there are many new competitors that continue to come in the market. I have been impressed with the seat growth to Hawaii (while unexpected) such as the new CO flight and Alaska's presence. Virgin America (who participates in NYOP) and Jet Blue (who does not participate in NYOP) have continued to add destinations.

I think the message is still the same, if a desired date/flight pair is selling for much higher than the lowest retail price that is found in the route, Priceline is a very good option. I think Priceline is getting inventory even if it is the last few seats on the plane (and simultaneously it is also available via retail). Whoever sells the seats first, gets the win.

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Old Jan 13, 11, 1:32 pm
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I have used Priceline NYOP for airfare a few times in the distant pass, but as you point out:
Originally Posted by rasheed View Post
It could also be argued that the product is significantly more inconvenient versus the hotel or rental car bid options in terms of options, but for many situations, Priceline air bidding is a viable option.
Basically you have to potentially sacrifice your entire day of travel in each direction, which is an option I've not been willing to accept for several years.

(On a related note, didn't Priceline used to have a 'weekender' option for NYOP airfare where they gave a little more specificity to the flight times for weekend bookings?)
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Old Jan 13, 11, 2:24 pm
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Originally Posted by Beckles View Post
(On a related note, didn't Priceline used to have a 'weekender' option for NYOP airfare where they gave a little more specificity to the flight times for weekend bookings?)
I don't recall anything like this with the NYOP airfare, however Priceline still has a "playtime guarantee" for vacation packages (air + hotel) for two & three night stays. For two nights, they guarantee you 44 hours "on the ground" at your destination, or 64 hours for three night packages. Note this guarantee only applies to vacation packages where you select the opaque NYOP-style air component. It obviously doesn't apply if you select retail air where you choose your own flights/times.
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Old Jan 13, 11, 2:33 pm
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The last time I used NYOP for air was in April 2001. At that time, there were $50 bonus links for booking air. I booked 2 tickets at the time: LAX-PHX & LAX-SFO. With the bonuses, it cost less than $100 for both tickets.

On the PHX-LAX trip, UA oversold the flight & I collected $600. Flew out the next morning & got to stay in nice hotel.

The drawbacks on the NYOP were flights can be nearly anytime during the day. I think I had afternoon outbounds & morning returns. (That was Fri-Sun days).

If I had no status & didn't care much for time of day, airline, etc, NYOP air may work fine. I like my upgrades & double miles so I haven't done one since 2001.

Very interesting thread.
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Old Jan 14, 11, 1:25 pm
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Playtime Guarantee

Originally Posted by Beckles View Post
(On a related note, didn't Priceline used to have a 'weekender' option for NYOP airfare where they gave a little more specificity to the flight times for weekend bookings?)
I cannot tell if the Playtime Guarantee is only for Vacation packages or it also applies to NYOP air-only bookings. Does anyone have experience with such NYOP 2 night or 3 night air-only bookings? It appears because of the hotel tie-in, it may only apply to vacation packages.

Link with Playtime text:

http://travelb.priceline.com/promo/h..._SAVEBIG&rdr=2

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Old Jan 14, 11, 3:17 pm
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Interesting ... that would be good, but you'd still need to be a little flexibile. For example, if I wanted to book a trip to PHX next weekend and I selected Friday - Sunday, I'd have to be willing to sacrifice my entire Friday instead of being able to fly out Friday night. Of course, given the ridiculously low airfare for such a trip I can get using the Negotiator right now for such a trip for next weekend, it's not a terrible sacrifice.

See this site for a description of the Weekender feature that was offered (and apparently has been replaced by the Playtime Guarantee) that allowed you to select flight time windows, so for example on my Friday to Sunday trip I could have selected a 4-9 PM flight time window on Friday and the same for Sunday.
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Old Jan 30, 11, 6:43 am
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Question

Taxes/fees indicate non-stop flights

Could you be more specific for those of us who are still learning?

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Old Jan 31, 11, 4:36 pm
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Taxes/fees indicate how many stops

Originally Posted by gentryart View Post
Taxes/fees indicate non-stop flights

Could you be more specific for those of us who are still learning?

Thanks
Because airports have slightly different fees, for domestic purposes, I have listed approximate amounts.

Sure, for a given route, there are three possible tax amounts:

1) Non-Stop both directions (closer to $20)
2) Non-Stop and One-Stop (doesn't matter which direction -- you couldn't choose anyway) (closer to $30)
3) One-Stop both directions (closer to $40)

Priceline will take the tax amount and add their fee. Their fee varies, but it is close to $8 currently. Basically, the estimated tax/fee amount tells you the likelyhood of what type of flights. Knowing what type of flights are in Priceline's inventory may help you decide a bit on your bidding value for those tickets before you are 'stuck' with the resulting ticket.

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